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ORIGINS OF LIFE | EVOLUTION | INTELLIGENT DESIGN

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AllSpark
Member
#346 | Posted: 7 Feb 2013 21:11
Reply 
Hi wensam,
It wasn't a coil, it was a solid straight edged shape akin to pyramid with power nodes. Point of interest was the fact that nothing could travel through it in a straight line..... which as skipman pointed out, seems to be born out by modern physics. Everything travels through in waves that pass through nodes.
Seems to me that mathematics, and all it's relationships(3,6,9 etc) are most important to anything that moves.
wensam
Member
#347 | Posted: 8 Feb 2013 14:29
Reply 
AllSpark:
all it's relationships(3,6,9 etc) are most important to anything that moves.

Interesting, i hadn't thought in those simple terms before :) makes sense.
Circles and triangles are interesting here too. If you draw a circle and then draw an equilateral triangle in the middle to fill the circle and repeat ie another circle and then another trinagle inside etc, THEN repeat this motif radially from the centre out and join up the vertices of the triangles you get a flower of life pattern emerging from the vertices of the triangles. Iv also made a flower of life, or should i say seed of life out of chunky copper jump rings- simple and beautiful.
Are you going to make another model AllSpark?- you should, so we can see.

At some point i realised that my complete lack of scientific knowledge and training was actually a good thing- less physics baggage to unload- I'm a blank canvas.
AllSpark:
Seems to me that mathematics, and all it's relationships(3,6,9 etc) are most important to anything that moves.

Yes, but i recently read something, slipped my mind at moment, that suggested not everything can be explained by mathematics, something to do with activity produced at microcellular level, to do with creative energy becoming manifest? Will have to get back to you on that one.

I imagine you have seen this?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh8VJ-5a3uI
Microbiology revealed through Sumerian sacred geometry, please enjoy.
AllSpark
Member
#348 | Posted: 8 Feb 2013 21:29
Reply 
Without the laws of mathematics....... nothing can exist.
It really is that simple, you see nothing can halve itself ( earliest form of reproduction ) without math. Nothing can breathe, nothing can move etc etc ........without laws of mathematics governing movement. Therefore before anything came into existance, the laws of mathematics were already in place. So the question becomes ..... who designed mathematics and all its undeniable truths...... " for wherever and whatever you are, one and one equals two, and always will".
wensam
Member
#349 | Posted: 8 Feb 2013 21:35
Reply 
AllSpark:
for wherever and whatever you are, one and one equals two, and always will".

Ah, but no- 1 add 1 can sometimes equal 3... if you open your mind.
Maths will explain the stasus, a certain state of affairs, but will never account for aberrations that cannot be predicted such as random events, or are they calculated too? What about surges of energy, sudden and dramatic like tsunami, soloton? Maths will explain, define it's form whatever it may take, but what accounts for the initial movement, the impetus, or is that down to historical evidence?
skipman
Member
#350 | Posted: 8 Feb 2013 22:20
Reply 
wensam:
Ah, but no- 1 add 1 can sometimes equal 3... if you open your mind.

Wensam is right AllSpark. There is a branch of quantum mechanics formulated by Paul Durac,one of England's greatest and least known mathematical giants. Even Einstein said "He scares me" because he could not fully grasp what Durac could.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/4436537/Paul-Dirac-One-of-the-greatest-British- minds-of-the-20th-century.html
wensam
Member
#351 | Posted: 8 Feb 2013 22:30
Reply 
skipman:
There is a branch of quantum mechanics formulated by Paul Durac,one of England's greatest and least known mathematical giants. Even Einstein said "He scares me" because he could not fully grasp what Durac could.

And wheres MK when you need him! lol
Skipman, im so vague, gratitude, and thanks for the verification- i need to explore further than the couple of previous links on the matter- not as easy as it could be, just as well i use empiricism as a reflective tool and not a diagnostic!
Interesting you quote the telegraph. When i was called for jury duty a number of years ago i was told if i didn't want to be selected then i should carry the telgraph! I want to be and was so i smiled nicely at the spy advocate in the gods watching down on us.
AllSpark
Member
#352 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 07:01 | Edited by: AllSpark
Reply 
Ok, lets see..........this is my position on this....
there can only be two states. Either 'everything' or 'nothing'. To go looking to find the state of ' nothing' ( ie, before the big bang.hahahaha.... sorry, just makes me laugh), is an excersise in futility because to find it would be ' something'....... its simply not there !
The fact is that there has always been ' everything'. The 'grand quest' is to find ' everything'...... and this, is mathematical equations. One plus one is an equation. All equations can be found in ALL numbers. And because numbers go on to infinity its imposible to ever know everything. So this too is an excersise in futility. All we can do is find equations within the numbers we have so far discovered ( which is probably what the most powerful computer can count up to) so our discovery of equations is dependant on the software and the size of the memory which holds the largest number.
When a child learns to count ie 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9..... the first equation is to add or double.... so from 1 we then get 2. At this point the child knows nothing of geometry ( because you have to get to 3 to make an enclosed shape ) so at this point the child has not discovered a triangle or angles or any equations which include the prperties of angles. Neither has the cube been discovered because the child has to have discovered 4. As the child continues counting and discovering more numbers, lets say up to 200, then equations such as prime numbers etc begin to appear and the whole thing starts to become more difficult.
I have no doubt that mathematicians have missed more than they have found. So IMO we are growing withing a system which is infinate and the process of ' counting' IS the basis of all things....... life IS numbers. We just have to find the hidden equations to quantify it.
We had to count to 186,000 before we discovered the speed of light for example.
abitofgreen
Member
#353 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 10:57
Reply 
wensam:

Maths will explain the stasus, a certain state of affairs, but will never account for aberrations that cannot be predicted such as random events, or are they calculated too?

Maths is not my favourite subject. I'm not sure if reality can all be broken down into mathematical equations but perhaps this dimension can. What I do know is that, reality as we know it, is an artificial, holographic construct and therefore could very well have an architect working to a mathematical model....I'm on the fence!

Consciousness is the basis for all reality, without the observer nothing in this reality would exist....of that I'm sure. The more consciousness looks with a view to finding mathematical answers the more mathematical equations will appear to resolve the questions.
wensam
Member
#354 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 11:21
Reply 
AllSpark:
When a child learns to count ie 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9..... the first equation is to add or double.... so from 1 we then get 2. At this point the child knows nothing of geometry ( because you have to get to 3 to make an enclosed shape ) so at this point the child has not discovered a triangle or angles or any equations which include the prperties of angles. Neither has the cube been discovered because the child has to have discovered 4. As the child continues counting and discovering more numbers, lets say up to 200, then equations such as prime numbers etc begin to appear and the whole thing starts to become more difficult.

Lovely, you should be a maths teacher in the infant department! Imagine if maths was explained like this from the start, our children would have a far better understanding and be more creative adults.
I can see your point, but what about emotions, are they quantifiable within an equation?
AllSpark:
To go looking to find the state of ' nothing' ( ie, before the big bang.hahahaha.... sorry, just makes me laugh), is an excersise in futility because to find it would be ' something'....... its simply not there !

hahahaha, very good!
wensam
Member
#355 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 11:29
Reply 
abitofgreen:
Consciousness is the basis for all reality, without the observer nothing in this reality would exist....of that I'm sure.

Yes, agree. Numbers are an expression, a way of describing something within a system or particular model. Our bodies work on ratios, we are constructed from ratios, that is the blueprint, but there are other ways to describe things, numbers are symbolic in that they correspond to a certain state. Some individuals see numbers as or equate them with colours and feelings- there is more to find out here.
AllSpark
Member
#356 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 14:48 | Edited by: AllSpark
Reply 
Let me have another try at explaining myself.
numbers are much much more than expression.
They are the tool used to create everything..... even a thought in your head or in the head of anything else for that matter. Before consciousness can form, numbers were there first.
Any thought formed has structure....it has movement so it has to use the rules of mathematics in which to form.
So even consciousness has to use the tool of mathematics to even begin to wonder about something.
Just sit and think, for example, at the number 7. On either side is 6 & 8 both of which can be halved, both are divisable by 2, one is divisable by 3 and the other by 4. But 7 ... ? Not alot seems to be going on......... until we discover prime numbers. It does'nt seem to sit well between 6 & 8 does it. So why is it there ?
Absolutely everything, whatever your imagination can produce, must use mathematics to begin.
It is the ultimate truth. It does'nt lie. It is simply there, and always has been.
It is the most beautiful elegant thing i have ever seen and if your looking for GOD, this is a good place to start.
wensam
Member
#357 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 15:15
Reply 
AllSpark:
It is the most beautiful elegant thing i have ever seen and if your looking for GOD, this is a good place to start.

A poet too AllSpark, good to read.
I do agree with you, just wanted to know your thoughts. ;)
If all is down to frequency, as i believe then you are of course correct that it's all about numbers.
AllSpark:
he number 7. On either side is 6 & 8 both of which can be halved, both are divisable by 2, one is divisable by 3 and the other by 4. But 7 ... ? Not alot seems to be going on......... until we discover prime numbers. It does'nt seem to sit well between 6 & 8 does it. So why is it there ?

That's interesting, i dont see these things, thanks for pointing it out.
AllSpark
Member
#358 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 15:31
Reply 
Its nice to be able to form and develop our ideas on here. Not a subject i can broach on the golf course or down the pub is it ! Tee hee hee :)
Thanks for responding wensam.....
so come on, lets hear one of your ideas. Straight from your own head. :)
wensam
Member
#359 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 15:39
Reply 

skipman, Dirac sounded well high up, on the high functioning side of autism or aspergers syndrome. Poor man, i bet his mother was a saint.
abitofgreen
Member
#360 | Posted: 9 Feb 2013 15:47
Reply 
AllSpark:
They are the tool used to create everything..... even a thought in your head or in the head of anything else for that matter. Before consciousness can form, numbers were there first.

If I'm understanding you correctly here you're using the typical western science viewpoint of consciousness... that consciousness is a bi-product of chemical and electrical activity in the brain. If that is the case then I disagree.

AllSpark:
Absolutely everything, whatever your imagination can produce, must use mathematics to begin.
It is the ultimate truth. It does'nt lie. It is simply there, and always has been.
It is the most beautiful elegant thing i have ever seen and if your looking for GOD, this is a good place to start.


Substitute the word mathematics with consciousness and you would be spot on IMO.

consciousness is everything.....everything is connected....nothing is separate.....consciousness IS God. It is everything there ever was or will be.

Mathematics is just a decoding tool used by our brains, derived from consciousness (as everything is) to decode this 3D reality made up of vibration/energy in a mathematical form. I'm sure there are many other realities all using a different mathematical decoding models.

Western science is starting to catch up with this model now, in the form of quantum mechanics and the electric model of the universe , one which eastern philosophy and some early western philosophers have been saying for a long time is the true nature of reality.

I lioke this quote from Albert Einstein....."Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one."
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